B777-300ER - The Nation 25 Dec

[zerbaer]

New PIA plane develops fault during flight

AMRAIZ KHAN
LAHORE - PIA’s brand new plane 777-300ER, on its maiden flight from New York to Karachi via Manchester and Islamabad, could not fly for Karachi after its stopover at Islamabad airport due to technical reasons on Saturday night, well placed sources in the national flag carrier confided to The Nation here on Sunday.
As per details, the said plane was on its maiden flight as PK-7182 on extra section after its delivery from the Boeing Company from New York to Karachi via Manchester Islamabad. As the plane landed at Islamabad Airport at 00:30 am, it could not leave for Karachi since its batteries were depleted, sources added.
The airline management shifted the passengers to the hotel and then sent them Karachi by some other flights and asked flight engineers from Karachi to solve the problem.
A team of engineers rushed to Islamabad and flew the plane as ferry flight to Karachi after the delay of over 12 hours.
An aviation expert, seeking for anonymity, said that it reflected the output of the PIA team of engineers who went for acceptance of the aircraft from Boeing Company.
It is pertinent to mention here that initially, PIA has bought six aeroplanes from Boeing including four 777-200ER and two 777-200LR for direct flight from Pakistan to America but American Home Land Security has not allowed PIA for its direct flight to America.
The 777-300ER is the revised and updated version of 777-200ER.
Spokesman of PIA, when contacted said it was true that the said aircraft had to face problem at Islamabad airport due to technical reasons. He informed that battery charger of the aircraft failed at the time of landing at Islamabad airport and it was replaced later. He said that inquiry into the case would be held soon.

[ConnieMan]

Its not a big problem, every new aircraft goes though few sangs before getting into routine fights, its in some ways better that these snags happens in initail days for aircrafts life and not in long run.....But its unfortunate that things happend with PIA in this manner with B/N BT7s!...

[Moin]

Its not the a/c's fault. This airline is jinxed!

[ConnieMan]

Hey Moin, i was being bit Polite, but you have spoken the very thruth!!, sometime i think PIA and our prople dosen't deserve new planes, they are better off with old clunkers , i am sure Boeing is not happy with this news atall...

[PK777]

Its not the a/c's fault. This airline is jinxed!

lol... Connie Moin's just being sarcastic.. This is a typical attitude the media take when anything goes wrong they dont understand anything and just start blaming people or aircraft and start telling what they should do to resolve it with no prior experience...

[Cobra]

Its not the a/c's fault. This airline is jinxed!

This is a typical attitude the media take when anything goes wrong they dont understand anything and just start blaming people or aircraft and start telling what they should do to resolve it with no prior experience...

Media is the watchdog. With EU and SAFA episodes the media has every right to question the failure of PIA Engineering in keeping the brand new machine airworthy. With the recent amazing salary raise of the Engineerig personnel, the media does not buy this PIA type buffoonery.

[Moin]

This cannot be entirely blamed on PIA engineering as the a/c was coming from the Boeing company in Seattle.

Either way, there are always teething problems and a major issue should be made about it. How do we know whether AF, EK, EVA, ANA, JAL, SIA or EY haven't had similar problems with their a/c? Maybe they have, we just don't know about it and I'm sure they don't go reporting it in their papers.

[Adnan Anwar]

This cannot be entirely blamed on PIA engineering as the a/c was coming from the Boeing company in Seattle.

Either way, there are always teething problems and a major issue should be made about it. How do we know whether AF, EK, EVA, ANA, JAL, SIA or EY haven't had similar problems with their a/c? Maybe they have, we just don't know about it and I'm sure they don't go reporting it in their papers.

Moin is right, many regulatory authorities either hush up or their media does not find much story in it to talk unlike Pakistani media.

If you go to NTSB website, you wil find that so many incidents that go unreported to media or media does not find a story in it. Check it out

http://www.ntsb.gov/Publictn/publictn.htm

[Noonray]

Unfortunately PIA 'enjoys' a reputation by which it is blamed for everything that goes wrong. This time with a brand new aircraft that PIA's maintenance had not touched yet, Boeing must be held responsible. I agree with the member who says new aircraft develop snags. More sometimesthan older ones which have been debugged, it might be said.

I was on board British Airways second-ever 777 scheduled flight, from London to Dubai,
some years ago. The aircraft was named 'Sir Charles Kingsford Smith' after the legendary
British aviator. Then, this was only the second 777 in commercial operation in the world ,
the first being with American Airlines. Water supply to the bathrooms was sporadic. Some
call bells and reading lights did not work, nor did the entertainment system (which apparently
still springs problems) and a host of other software operated features in the cabin. I chatted with the
purser who said Boeing's engineers were present during every flight and would continue
to be there for a month to troubleshoot and rectify inflight. "Hardly anything works" he added,
his frustration evident.

Members would know that the 777 does not have as trouble-free a reputation as other
airliners. It might have progressed since its early days in service when operators had quite a
few technical headaches to deal with on their brand new 777's. But it still has problems,
blamed by engineers, pilots and cabin crew I have spoken with, on the very high degree
of computerisation and automation.

I do not agree with the member who says it is better to have faults developing now than
later. Not when passengers' safety is involved. I am sure members would recall the recent
fire in the Malaysian 777's port engine after takeoff at Stockholm, and the APU fire in the
PIA 777 on landing at Karachi which caused an emergency evacuation of passengers.

As a passenger on 777's on a number of airlines, I find Boeing have still not been able to solve
the problems in bathrooms, of water in the basins draining far too slowly and the user-unfriendly
design of the mirror which protrudes half over the basin making it impossible to wash one's face
without splashing the floor. Meanwhile at the back of my mind I know that the likelihood of
getting to my destination in one piece is good because all the aircraft's essential systems
have one if not two backups!

Lastly I cannot but smile at The Nation's correspondent who says PIA's engineers flew the
777 to Karachi from Islamabad. Come, come, Mr Amraiz Khan, even PIA would not allow that!

[Cobra]

Unfortunately PIA 'enjoys' a reputation by which it is blamed for everything that goes wrong. This time with a brand new aircraft that PIA's maintenance had not touched yet, Boeing must be held responsible. I agree with the member who says new aircraft develop snags.

Members would know that the 777 does not have as trouble-free a reputation as other
airliners. It might have progressed since its early days in service when operators had quite a
few technical headaches to deal with on their brand new 777's. But it still has problems,
blamed by engineers, pilots and cabin crew I have spoken with, on the very high degree
of computerisation and automation.

As a passenger on 777's on a number of airlines, I find Boeing have still not been able to solve
the problems in bathrooms, of water in the basins draining far too slowly and the user-unfriendly
design of the mirror which protrudes half over the basin making it impossible to wash one's face without splashing the floor.

Lastly I cannot but smile at The Nation's correspondent who says PIA's engineers flew the
777 to Karachi from Islamabad. Come, come, Mr Amraiz Khan, even PIA would not allow that!

PIA engineers accompany the flight on board the aircraft. They don't fly. They travel First Class. Talking about Boeing's responsibility in this case allow me the liberty to recall wheel brake fires on the B-777s due to the use of some sub-standard grease approved by PIA in an effort to cut down maintenance costs. Boeing recorded it's displeasure on such experiments.

[CoyBoy]

773ER is now parked at KHI near Hangar, saw it today.

[Noonray]

Cobra, you are quite right about that sub-standard grease. Inexcusable, and sadly no heads would have rolled as a consequence either. PIA is not populated by angels, but then not all by devils either -that's my point. As for engineers travelling first class, I haven't come across any there I confess. Anyhow, PIA doesn't have first class on its aircraft any longer, only business.

[ConnieMan]

I agree with the member who says new aircraft develop snags. More sometimesthan older ones which have been debugged, it might be said.


I do not agree with the member who says it is better to have faults developing now than
later. Not when passengers' safety is involved. I am sure members would recall the recent
fire in the Malaysian 777's port engine after takeoff at Stockholm, and the APU fire in the
PIA 777 on landing at Karachi which caused an emergency evacuation of passengers.


Lastly I cannot but smile at The Nation's correspondent who says PIA's engineers flew the
777 to Karachi from Islamabad. Come, come, Mr Amraiz Khan, even PIA would not allow that!

I think you misunderstood what i said or meant, all i said it is better if these earlier snags/ teething problems show up now and can get fixed before aircraft gets into full revinue service!, this is one of the reason why many airlines just ferry first delivery flights from manufactures to the airlines main hub station, specially on long distance flights. This way if something small goes wrong, its all kept inside and no one gets to know about it, specially on brand spanking new aircraft that just flew few short test flights and one transcontinantal flight.

I surely don't want to risk any of passengers life atall but its happenend to some dgree on this flight. As for media all theyu want is to blow things out or proportion specially in pakistan, all happend so fast and even airlines diden't know why and media just went on to blame PIA for it. This kind of things just makes me laugh at our pakistani media....

[umar744]

hello salam
merry xmas
boeing saleperson were good to all other airline to purchase boeing aircraft then ordered new aircraft to production building aircraft and some other labour job employment people some time too fast fit and sometime lazy not properly fit due to deadline and work time 9hours per day that why aircraft self fault happen or perhaps boeing put fault or cheap or out of date parts into aircraft or perhaps when aircraft breakdown and request repair then spend lots of money cost repair to job that why job people NEED money £££ $$$$ €€€€. if first class fit strict fix no repair then job people will become bore alone home no job that why need money and sell parts replacement. my friend deaf worked in Boeing for 4 years and he visited London to met me at museum and talked. He said me did know Ex-BA / former British Airways two 2 Boeing 777-236 have beed broke up and scrapped in USA. I did not know it and I read aviation letter magazine confirmed it aged 11-12yrs old short life.
I hope PIA b773ER recovery and PIA learn experience of Boeing aircraft problem and next time carefully,
PIA should buy A340-600HGW because no restricted payload because
full payload without fuel is 235,000kg and require fuel trip to Toronto is 120000kg total 355000kg but maximum take off 380000kg but
b773ER full payload is 237000kg and Full fuel 145000kg total 382000kg but maximum take off is 351000kg.
Thai A340-600 fly nonstop BKK-LAX and BKK-JFK no problem.
PIA's three 3 A310-325 are very good AP-BGQ, AP-BGR, AP-BGS full payload is 114000kg and full fuel is 50000kg = maximum take off is 164000kg excellent. I flew AP-BGQ took off 162000kg from Birmingham to Islamabad landed 124000kg no problem. fuel trip 38000kg. fuel left 10,000kg.
A340-500/600 NO need worry ETOPS.
why Boeing cannot offer put crew rest room and maximum increase take off aircraft???
A380 are excellent
Up to you like
good luck
Last time Qantas 747-400 have been breakdown problem many times on my flight also BA 777-200 have been breakdown my flight twice time.
regards

[F27]

A discussion on the subject reveals that buying the B777 was a decision made in haste and PIA might end up being a loser once again.