PIA YYZ news

[behramjee]

i sent u a personal msg to call me at work.

please do so and we can then talk further on this matter.

thanks

[Jacobin777]

1. Loads since Feb 15th have been vvv poor. Reasons being that their fares to KHI is $ 150 more expensive than Etihad, $ 20 more than Gulf Air and $ 200 more than EK (if taken via JFK).

2. Loads are in 50-60% range.

3. To ISB/LHE, their fares are $ 100 more than GF, $ 120 more than EY for an adult. For a child, their fares from YYZ to Northern Pakistan and KHI are over $ 100-130 more than EY-GF.

4. PIA have been calling its consolidators and especially its top 10 agents since the last 2 weeks pleading with them to try and make pax fly on their airline rather than EY-GF especially.

5. PIA had an excellent J class fare of CAD $ 2400 return for YYZ-PAK-YYZ in Feb but since the LRs have come here, they have increased it by $ 1500 to $ 3900!!! This is when their J class loads arent even 35% full on the YYZ-PAK-YYZ flight.

6. This year PIA doesnt have a family nor Seniors fare!!!

I've been calling travel agents around (thanks for help..not), and PK has economy fares for $1460 Canadian and $1610 Canadian for economy plus........

thats much better than other carriers...

[behramjee]

I've been calling travel agents around (thanks for help..not), and PK has economy fares for $1460 Canadian and $1610 Canadian for economy plus........

$ 1460 on PIA means the agent is making a $ 12 profit where as for the same price he/she would make a $ 30 profit if selling GF. Etihad all taxes inclusive to KHI is $ 1340 CDN.

thats much better than other carriers...

No it isnt...like I mentioned above EY is much cheaper and so is EK via JFK-DXB which is CDN $ 1260 all taxes inclusive.

To LHE-ISB, PIA is much more expensive than EY-GF-EK-QR.

This market is very price sensitive as is the case with all big desi expat markets.

[Jacobin777]

I've been calling travel agents around (thanks for help..not), and PK has economy fares for $1460 Canadian and $1610 Canadian for economy plus........

$ 1460 on PIA means the agent is making a $ 12 profit where as for the same price he/she would make a $ 30 profit if selling GF. Etihad all taxes inclusive to KHI is $ 1340 CDN.

thats much better than other carriers...

No it isnt...like I mentioned above EY is much cheaper and so is EK via JFK-DXB which is CDN $ 1260 all taxes inclusive.

To LHE-ISB, PIA is much more expensive than EY-GF-EK-QR.

This market is very price sensitive as is the case with all big desi expat markets.

behramjee..thanks for the inputs, but I respectfully disagree..

even though I know us Pakistanis are price sensitive, the EK JFK-KHI isn't too good of a flight at all.....there are too many stops and connections, which is a big hassle, not to metion, lost baggage, immigration, etc.
also, its going to cost to get to JFK, which completely negates it's price advantage.....

as I stated..this does tend to be a slower period for PK, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are doing fare testing for a little while until they figure out what works best for them..

[sadiqhassan]

behramjee..thanks for the inputs, but I respectfully disagree..

even though I know us Pakistanis are price sensitive, the EK JFK-KHI isn't too good of a flight at all.....there are too many stops and connections, which is a big hassle, not to metion, lost baggage, immigration, etc.
also, its going to cost to get to JFK, which completely negates it's price advantage.....

as I stated..this does tend to be a slower period for PK, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are doing fare testing for a little while until they figure out what works best for them..

YYZ-JFK-DXB-KHI is the same amount of connections as GF/QR/EY etc

Also, the C$1260 with EK includes YYZ-JFK-YYZ flights

Cheers

[Jacobin777]

behramjee..thanks for the inputs, but I respectfully disagree..

even though I know us Pakistanis are price sensitive, the EK JFK-KHI isn't too good of a flight at all.....there are too many stops and connections, which is a big hassle, not to metion, lost baggage, immigration, etc.
also, its going to cost to get to JFK, which completely negates it's price advantage.....

as I stated..this does tend to be a slower period for PK, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are doing fare testing for a little while until they figure out what works best for them..

YYZ-JFK-DXB-KHI is the same amount of connections as GF/QR/EY etc

Also, the C$1260 with EK includes YYZ-JFK-YYZ flights

Cheers

ASA Sadiq...

yes, it was assumed all the other air carriers such as GF/QR/EY have the same "connection problem"...and the advantage with PK is there are much less connections.............

Maybe the price you mentioned with EK is from YYZ with a travel agent, but I put in a bunch of random dates on EK.com and this is one of the better fares I get..

"USD 1,163.18 for 1 passenger(s)
(total fare: USD1,080.00 plus total taxes USD83.18 )"

[sadiqhassan]

ASA Sadiq...

yes, it was assumed all the other air carriers such as GF/QR/EY have the same "connection problem"...and the advantage with PK is there are much less connections.............

Maybe the price you mentioned with EK is from YYZ with a travel agent, but I put in a bunch of random dates on EK.com and this is one of the better fares I get..

"USD 1,163.18 for 1 passenger(s)
(total fare: USD1,080.00 plus total taxes USD83.18 )"

But the disadvantage with PK is the frequencies... Only once a week to each city in Pakistan. So despite all the connections, the other airlines have a clear advantage.

emirates.com lists published fares. We are talking about consolidator fares. None of the fares mentioned here are fares that you can get on airlines websites.

Cheers

ps what's ASA

[Jacobin777]

ASA Sadiq...

yes, it was assumed all the other air carriers such as GF/QR/EY have the same "connection problem"...and the advantage with PK is there are much less connections.............

Maybe the price you mentioned with EK is from YYZ with a travel agent, but I put in a bunch of random dates on EK.com and this is one of the better fares I get..

"USD 1,163.18 for 1 passenger(s)
(total fare: USD1,080.00 plus total taxes USD83.18 )"

But the disadvantage with PK is the frequencies... Only once a week to each city in Pakistan. So despite all the connections, the other airlines have a clear advantage.

emirates.com lists published fares. We are talking about consolidator fares. None of the fares mentioned here are fares that you can get on airlines websites.

Cheers

ps what's ASA

you are correct with the days of the frequency situation with PK, AFAIK with most Pakistani's, the day doesn't make too much of a difference, especially for the aunties and uncles....but a less connection does.......

PK will lose some customers because they don't offer daily customers, but PK has been doing that for years....it doesn't hurd them as much as say if VS were to cut LHR-JFK......

also, my price wasn't via a consolidator either, so in effect, the fares can be extremely close..

p.s.- ASA is "salaam"....

[sadiqhassan]

you are correct with the days of the frequency situation with PK, AFAIK with most Pakistani's, the day doesn't make too much of a difference, especially for the aunties and uncles....but a less connection does.......

PK will lose some customers because they don't offer daily customers, but PK has been doing that for years....it doesn't hurd them as much as say if VS were to cut LHR-JFK......

also, my price wasn't via a consolidator either, so in effect, the fares can be extremely close..

p.s.- ASA is "salaam"....

If somone is a leisure traveller with an open schedule, then PIA might work for them. However, in all other situations it won't work - business / holiday time etc

Your price for which airline?

Cheers

[Jacobin777]

you are correct with the days of the frequency situation with PK, AFAIK with most Pakistani's, the day doesn't make too much of a difference, especially for the aunties and uncles....but a less connection does.......

PK will lose some customers because they don't offer daily customers, but PK has been doing that for years....it doesn't hurd them as much as say if VS were to cut LHR-JFK......

also, my price wasn't via a consolidator either, so in effect, the fares can be extremely close..

p.s.- ASA is "salaam"....

If somone is a leisure traveller with an open schedule, then PIA might work for them. However, in all other situations it won't work - business / holiday time etc

Your price for which airline?

Cheers

i see very few pakistanis who complain about one or two days.....
not sure by what you meant by "price for which airline"..PK or EK?

[behramjee]

1. GF is the only airline now offering ONE YEAR FARES from YYZ at NO ADDITIONAL COST.

2. Date Changes on GFs new ex Canada fares to Indian subcontinent can be made unlimited number of times FREE OF COST and valid for one year!!!

3. For EK u pay $ 400 extra for 1 yr validity...for PIA u pay $ 200 extra to extend a 4 month tkt to a 6 month tkt.

[sadiqhassan]

i see very few pakistanis who complain about one or two days.....
not sure by what you meant by "price for which airline"..PK or EK?

Most of my family in Karachi don't fly PIA because of the lack of frequency...

you said "also my price wasn't via a consolidator" i was not sure which fare you meant

Cheers

[Jacobin777]

i see very few pakistanis who complain about one or two days.....
not sure by what you meant by "price for which airline"..PK or EK?

Most of my family in Karachi don't fly PIA because of the lack of frequency...

you said "also my price wasn't via a consolidator" i was not sure which fare you meant

Cheers

I have friends and relatives who live in Toronto....frequency isn't a problem for them....

you mentioned that one can get EK seats for a good fare via a consolidator.....I listed my quote above from a regular travel agent...I wouldn't be surprised if one can get a better fare on PK with a consolidator also....

[sadiqhassan]

I have friends and relatives who live in Toronto....frequency isn't a problem for them....

you mentioned that one can get EK seats for a good fare via a consolidator.....I listed my quote above from a regular travel agent...I wouldn't be surprised if one can get a better fare on PK with a consolidator also....

If frequency is not a problem for them, they are probably leisure travellers with open schedules as I said before.

People with schedules or businessmen will not be able to use PIA in case their plans change by a day or 2, or if they need to be in Karachi / Toronto for only a few days.

OK I am still very confused with what you are saying. Here is what i am saying:

most of the fares that we are discussing here are fares that are not published. You can't go to any old TA or expedia to buy them. The one you got from Emirates.com is a published fare, which is why it is significantly higher. I don't think that you can get reasonable non negiotiated PIA fares at all... when I look on websites, I generally get prices upwards of C$6,000 for YYZ-KHI return.

Cheers

[Jacobin777]

I have friends and relatives who live in Toronto....frequency isn't a problem for them....

you mentioned that one can get EK seats for a good fare via a consolidator.....I listed my quote above from a regular travel agent...I wouldn't be surprised if one can get a better fare on PK with a consolidator also....

If frequency is not a problem for them, they are probably leisure travellers with open schedules as I said before.

People with schedules or businessmen will not be able to use PIA in case their plans change by a day or 2, or if they need to be in Karachi / Toronto for only a few days.

OK I am still very confused with what you are saying. Here is what i am saying:

most of the fares that we are discussing here are fares that are not published. You can't go to any old TA or expedia to buy them. The one you got from Emirates.com is a published fare, which is why it is significantly higher. I don't think that you can get reasonable non negiotiated PIA fares at all... when I look on websites, I generally get prices upwards of C$6,000 for YYZ-KHI return.

Cheers

I think we are same the same thing about the fares, so thats not a problem

PK relies heavy on O&D population...along with leisure travelers...

the fact they have 3x/weekly out of Toronto is amazing in itself, considering that they didnt' even serve YYZ until recently.....

I hope PK does well...