I was actually invited to visit the hangar last year through then Chairman Ahmed Saeeds P/A but never got around doing it, as they wanted me to submit the relevant documents as you mentioned. But it was cool to know what to expect.
Judging by what you've seen of the new tail, I was wondering if the Multani floral tile thing is anything similar to this example:
I would have mentioned something about the tail/colour scheme to TK if you had extra time.
btw was photography allowed ? considering the prescence of the corporate photographer I would have thought he was special one off for company purposes only.
Thanx for sharing your experience with us!
I can understand your concerns about the new tail scheme..... blending a blue tail with the rest of the current colour scheme will definitely be tough. But who knows it might look somewhat different out of the hanger as you said earlier... I guess we'll wait and see!
hmm...moin...how did u manage to get permission to attend the ceremony?
and i dont think engineers are not given free tickets for travelling..which is probably the only perk the flight crew have.....and as far as being over worked is concerned..the flight crew is over worked and under paid too...so it is'nt one portion of the corporation thats sufferring....
Well as soon as I get the pics that were taken of me by the photographer present, I'll send them to Abbas.
As far as getting permission to attend this, isn't wasn't that difficult. I simply had the right contact and I merely asked if it was possible and before I knew it I was told to be there at 3pm on Monday.
I wish a pass had been made out for me which I could have kept as a souvenir, as I submitted a copy of my ID card and a photo which I was told would be required for the apron pass, but it just ended up being a letter which the ASF received instructing them to let me through, and let through I was, and escorted to the front row and placed next to the Boeing executives.
hi moin ...that was a very insightful review. if only i could have been there to share the experience too. i however do have a few questions to ask of u in relation to ur meeting with TK and what u saw. firstly since pia has leased out the 6 a310s only last year it has to out of sheer compulsion use them till 2015, meaning to say that the 2xtra lrs being ordered will be brought in after the lease period has expired. secondly why did TK rule out the 744 and 748 for being fuel guzzlers. seems like i m gonna have my mother fix dinner with him next i m in khi so i can enlighten him on the performance of these aircrafts and how they suit pias operational profile. and if the boeing 777 deal absolutely has to be amplified wouldnt it make more sense to bring in the 380 seaters instead and use them on dense routes where the lrs wouldnt do the job. 2 would suffice in pias current operations with 12 310s and 6 743s for another 5-9 years, and until the retrirement of the 310s the improved 7E7 would make a better deal. the 39 aircraft plan is strectched beyond 2010 and by then many of these 777s would have better sucsessors . kirmani has made the best judgement choice by voting in the a380, the only better choice then the 747 in the world today for pia. lets see how long it takes him to place an order for those to replace the 747 fleet,cus like i ve always maintained that pia desperately would need those kind of aircraft to sustain their real flight schedule . whats the fate of the 733s ,if they re waiting to undergo their check whts the hurry in replacing them right away. i would take it that the order placed would be post 5 years. lastly how many ab4s of pia is mng using, cus until today i thought that all 6 were being flown. and if some have been painted in the new colors what are they still doing lying in the hanger.
Firstly the 2 extra LR's are not being ordered to use alongside the A310's. The 2 a/c are poles apart. The 2 extra LR's are being ordered bringing a total of 4 LR's into the fleet as according to TK (and myself) 2 a/c are not enough if PIA plans to fly nonstop to JFK, ORD and YYZ. If one a/c goes in for line maintenance, the whole schedule will be upset if only 2 a/c are in the entire fleet. An example being BAK and BAT. Now that BAK is offline, the whole 74M schedule has been affected and BAT is doing double duty. As a result, PIA is now wanting to cash in on the nonstop long haul sector and that is precisely why they got these LR's and not as A310 replacements.
Secondly, no offence, but I should hardly think that TK will come running to be enlightened on the performance and advantages of 747's by the daughter of a 747 pilot. That would make it only too obvious of the objective trying to be achieved and ethically wrong. The daughter of an airline employee explaining to the Chairman in not so many words that he doesn't know what he's talking about. Not very professional and quite demeaning. Also he was referring to the current 747's in PIA as being gas guzzlers. TK is not an idiot, he knows what he's talking about and has done his homework.
Thirdly, the A380 was not in any way mentioned by TK. The Boeing rep merely spoke of it in passing when I asked him about the 747-8. The 747-8 is still in the development stages and no final decision has yet been made and unless airlines show an interest in the a/c, production will not commence. Boeing is still waiting to see the outcome of the A380 and those were the very words of the Boeing sales rep. I myself am clinging to the hope that new 747's will be ordered, so we have to wait and see.
Fourthy, only 2 AB4's of PIA are in use by MNG. One is in full MNG colors and sitting at KHI covered in dust. The other has been leased to SV and is in full white colors with the old SV tail colors and titles on the fuselage. The other 3 AB4's are still in full PIA new colors but are all missing the engines (one of the them the entire landing gear), trashed interiors and no flaps and spoilers. That should pretty much indicate that MNG bought them for spares and pick off whatever they require whenever. The AB4's are history. All, save for the SV, are parked outside and not in the hangar.
Fifthly, the plan is for 29 new a/c, not 39. That was my error. Got confused between unatees and untalees. Sorry.
i still strongly feel that instead of the lrs pia should buy more of the 380 seaters to keep its schedule running satisfactorily specially after the 747s with no properly matched replacement in sight. secondly TK is a very good friend of my mom and is extreemley receptive to ideas from all schools, infact he called my mother an encyclopedia when she poured out some pretty useful ideas on how to revamp its fight service products and some marketing tips too. shes still has a standing offer to join his team and i hope she takes it over what shes doing now,but old people can get irritatingly hung up at times. anyway i wont be comming from my fathers home when i talk to him about fleet planning cus i d be advocating the induction of the 744 or the 380 with hidden economic benefits in the shape of high capacity within slot caps. hes not touching the 743s till atleast another 5 years so that wont be an item of discussion. by the way when will these extra 777s arrive..after or before the grounding of 310s n 747s? lastly i still dint get u on the status of pias ex b4s( my favorite type ever in pias fleet). one is flying for saudia and the other 2 are waiting to be put in to the schedule right. that still leaves one which according to u hasnt been dismantled for spares that they would perhaps need for their existing fleet of b4s that are older then the ones they bought from pia. initially when they bought them they were meant to be flown becus mng was on the anvil of contracting pia cockpit crew which turned down d offer. this has to be a recent decision for sure....!! u still havent updated me on the 737 status..?
Engineers down the line are hesitant performing the lap joint mod. However a GM in the engineering has taken up this challenge. So yes the 737-300 is here to stay for a while.
FK, your mom maybe very knowlegable when it comes to flights services and the like, I'm not disputing that, but the fact of the matter is that TK has done his homework vis a vis the 747's are concerned. Also I'm sure TK is enough of a gentleman not to contradict a lady.
The 747 fleet will be replaced and by the time the new replacements come, it will be at least 4 to 5 years down the line, especially if its a new derivative such as the 747-8. We can't see that in service for at least 5 years minimum, even if orders are placed next week.
I haven't a clue as to when the extra 777's will arrive. The second LR will arrive sometime this month, the first ATR in May and the second and third before the end of this year with the next 4 arriving next year and the 773ER's from next year or year after. The leased 772ER will also be joining next year. In addition to the initial order for 8 a/c, 4 more are coming being 1 772ER, 2 772LR's and most probably 1 more 773ER bringing the toal to 12 a/c. If new 747's are not in the pipeline then you basically have 12 777 a/c replacing 8 747 a/c. Smaller a/c, greater frequencies.
I think you'd better put the A380 on the back burner for the time being. TK did say that when they look to replace the A310, 737 and 747 fleet, thay will look at both Boeing and Airbus but that does not mean that they'll go all and all out for the A380. Our airports are not capable of handling such an a/c as yet.
As far as the AB4's (the loves of your life) are concerned, I'm mentioning this one last time:
6 a/c parked at KHI. 1 belonging to PIA and 5 MNG's.
1 a/c in SV colors (MNG's), ex-PIA, is in the hangar for maintenance.
1 a/c (BAZ) scrapped by PIA. Its a hollow shell.
1 a/c in full MNG colors sitting outside next to BAZ collecting dust.
1 a/c minus engines and flaps (MNG's).
1 a/c also minus engines and flaps (MNG's).
1 a/c minus engines, flaps and landing gear (MNG's).
All of the above save for the SV leased a/c and the one in full MNG colors are also missing interiors. If you say that PIA sold MNG 6 AB4's then maybe the 6th one has been removed because BAZ was scrapped by PIA, not MNG
Now I should hardly think that MNG is preparing to use them, especially if PIA had just completed a full maintenance check on them before handing them over. They seem to be using just 2 and the other 4 have been cannibalised for spares and alot of those spares MNG has sold off to other buyers. Now if you have a gripe against that, you'd better contact MNG.
The AB4's are now part of the 'History of PIA' and you must face the stark reality of that. They might have been the sacred cow to you, but sadly the time has come to hold a Quran Khwani.
Very nice and detailed report Moin. I also share your concerns about the new tail, hopefully it doesn't turn out bad, but we will just have to wait and see.
Mood lighting is very much there and the PTV's are the same as in the ER's. As for the seats, there is a little bit more legroom in the Eco cabins versus the ER's which explains for the fewer seats. They pulled out 2 rows.
