BA Karachi

Discuss issues and news related to PIA, Pakistani airlines and Pakistan's civil & military aviation.
Amaad Lone
Registered Member
Posts: 2932
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Lahore

Post by Amaad Lone »

Amaad the discussion is about KHI, not ISB they had different routings so you wouldnt know.
The topic of the discussion is BA PAKISTAN, not BA KARACHI, so my two bits about this topic is valid. Thanks for the concern.

Now back to the orginal topic.

Karachi is an extremely low yield destination.

Gulf carriers are dumping excessive capacity for Karachi, killing any reason for European airlines to fly to there.

Even PIA has given up on Karachi, concentrating on Islamabad and Lahore for western flights.

If the government wants any European airline to return to Karachi, then it has to curtail the traffic rights of Emirates and Qatar.

Amaad
User avatar
smarties
Deactivated
Posts: 581
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: Where the wild roses grow

Post by smarties »

Karachi is an extremely low yield destination. Even PIA has given up on Karachi, concentrating on Islamabad and Lahore for western flights.
I would not go that far and say PIA has given up on Karachi. Karachi is the hub for PIA. PIA flights from LHR, JFK, MAN, ORD, YYZ, IAH, FRA, CDG all go to Karachi. Just cuz some of the flights go to LHE or ISB first does not automatically mean they have given up on Karachi.
"Now we're going round in circles, tell me will this deja vu never end?"
speedbird london
Registered Member
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:39 pm

BA into KHI

Post by speedbird london »

I see members are still debating the route BA took into KHI. In all seriousness does it really matter which way they went, as all the mebers who flew on the BA service got off at KHI.
I joined BA in 1990, by then BA had already stopped KHI operations. We were told for security and economical reasons it was no longer viable to fly to KHI. During near end of operation, im guessing now, 89-90, BA was flying varied routes to KHI, with varied fleet. They were using 767 and 747-200, via DXB only. Ba intially flew the routes with L1011's LHR-KUW-DXB-KHI. This then went to LHR-DXB-KHI when 767 was introduced, the crew stayed on the A/C, and returned back to DXB some 5-7 hours later, this was purely done for safety reasons.

As for BA's return to KHI, well its looking very hard. Personally, BA crew have no favours of returning to KHI, they struggle to fly the ISB route. As all crew dislike the route. As I can understand, from what I hear, EK cabin crew are punished by making them fly PAK routes. So it must be an Industry thing.
PK786
Registered Member
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2004 11:40 am
Location: LONDON

Post by PK786 »

In what ways is BA struggling to fly the ISB? I thought it did quite well!How come the crew don't like the route?
stylo4444
Registered Member
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2004 4:01 pm
Location: Orlando, FL

Post by stylo4444 »

BA is struggling on the Islamabad route??

That doesn't seem right at all...I travel that sector twice a year and have always noticed that the BA129/BA128 are full in World Traveller.
speedbird london
Registered Member
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:39 pm

BA into ISB

Post by speedbird london »

BA is struggling into ISB, not due to economical reason, but rather with the crew, who dislike flying into PAK full stop. As you BA fliers will notice, BA only uses a 2 Config A/C to ISB. There is no First Class service available to ISB. Our fleet was specially converted to cater for destinations that are less favourable for First class level off service. This was mainly for financial reasons. secondaly, you will find onboard these flights to ISB, there are a high volume of BA staff. At times the flight is empty, and only during summer months does it get busy. As its mango season, and high volume of cargo is carried.
My fellow colleague is a First officer on the 777, and has flown the ISB route, recently. He personally like ISB, for the cheapness, but wouldnt make it his holiday trip list, after all its only work. Where as EK crew really dislike the PAK routes, specially the Lahore and Peshwar sectors. As inside information, explains why. Its is annoying, and offensive, but understandable. sadly our fellow passengers from the India Subcontinent, and working in midde east are not so conversant with flying etiquettes. Also the short busy sectors are intense, for crew to give the full service. So for EK crew its like serving a full house with the added bonuses of difficult passengers. This is the explanation of EK crew. This is also reinforced, ba the BA crew, who used to fly the LHR-KUW-DXB-KHI route, as i was on this route often, and the Crew getting on at DXB, feared for they where about to experience. As the passengers joining from DXB where, the types, who carried portable radios on their shoulder, wearing their work clothes, smelling, and just sat where they liked. the crew found it very hard to take in these are passengers. But times moved on, people have become more educated and sensible, so that factor is now diminishing. but yes BA does struggle today, as the stop over is not the best of all the places on the BA network.
bagold
Registered Member
Posts: 126
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 3:39 pm
Location: London

Post by bagold »

Coyboy,

"speedbird since you are a BA employee maybe you can correct the information regarding KHI route in the 80's, I can confirm uptil 1986 they flew via Kuwait. "

I can confirm that BA flew to KHI till at least the beginning of 1988. I know because that was the year I got married and brought my wife to London on BA.


Speedbird London,

BA may have no inclination to start routes to KHI or LHE but how about BMed under BA colours? BMed already does a route to Tehran. I am not conversant with the intricacies of bi-lateral agreements, etc but would extending the Tehran service to KHI or LHE be a possibility?
Junaid
Registered Member
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:56 pm
Location: USA

Post by Junaid »

stylo4444,

I am flying ORD-ISB on BA next week. I am flying BA for the first time. How is the service and overall flight experience? Also, their cabin baggage allowance is only 13lbs. DO they really check the weight for cabin baggage?

Thanks
speedbird london
Registered Member
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:39 pm

BMEd to PAk and BA to US

Post by speedbird london »

Well, yes that would be s possibilty to allow BMed to fly to Pak, but the fleet they use is far to small, the largest A/C being a A321. Also as you mention the bi lateral agreement may not allow this to happen. Then, would you like to stop via Tehran or some other stop on the way to UK. As most passenger perfer non-stop flights. Also the A321 they use has increase fule capacity, Not sure if you aware, the A320 series A/C have an option to include a fuel container within the freight hold. This is for long routes, as the one to Tehran. So extending these routes i think would not be viable, as the load carrying capacity reduces.

As for BA service for Junaid, Well the service is as only aws good as the crew, and how they feel on the day. I can assure you though, Ive travelled many airlines, being in the industry, and BA does stick out. Not because i work for them, but they are customer focused and deliver the goods. Though, there are days when things just go wrong, and no matter who you are, it goes against you. Yes the cabin weight allowance is strict, this is due to Health & Safety regulations, which are very adhered to in UK. so please do keep to your allowance. My mother just went recently, and she was 2kg over on hang baggage, she was asked to put it in the checked in luggage. so BA is strict, but its for understandable reasons. just remember, the extra allowance you take, then times it by the amount of passengers travelling, you might have to add extra fuel to carry this extra weight, so someone has to pay, and we all know fuel is expensive at the moment. Anyway hope you enjoy the experience. May i mention our IFE is not as good as other airlines, so please dont expect the latest in IFE. We are modernising the fleet currently.
CoyBoy
Registered Member
Posts: 1738
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:13 pm
Location: Pakistan

Post by CoyBoy »

Sorry my mistake regarding the title, its been corrected now.
stylo4444
Registered Member
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2004 4:01 pm
Location: Orlando, FL

Re: BA into ISB

Post by stylo4444 »

speedbird london wrote:BA is struggling into ISB, not due to economical reason, but rather with the crew, who dislike flying into PAK full stop. As you BA fliers will notice, BA only uses a 2 Config A/C to ISB. There is no First Class service available to ISB. Our fleet was specially converted to cater for destinations that are less favourable for First class level off service. This was mainly for financial reasons. secondaly, you will find onboard these flights to ISB, there are a high volume of BA staff. At times the flight is empty, and only during summer months does it get busy. As its mango season, and high volume of cargo is carried.
My fellow colleague is a First officer on the 777, and has flown the ISB route, recently. He personally like ISB, for the cheapness, but wouldnt make it his holiday trip list, after all its only work. Where as EK crew really dislike the PAK routes, specially the Lahore and Peshwar sectors. As inside information, explains why. Its is annoying, and offensive, but understandable. sadly our fellow passengers from the India Subcontinent, and working in midde east are not so conversant with flying etiquettes. Also the short busy sectors are intense, for crew to give the full service. So for EK crew its like serving a full house with the added bonuses of difficult passengers. This is the explanation of EK crew. This is also reinforced, ba the BA crew, who used to fly the LHR-KUW-DXB-KHI route, as i was on this route often, and the Crew getting on at DXB, feared for they where about to experience. As the passengers joining from DXB where, the types, who carried portable radios on their shoulder, wearing their work clothes, smelling, and just sat where they liked. the crew found it very hard to take in these are passengers. But times moved on, people have become more educated and sensible, so that factor is now diminishing. but yes BA does struggle today, as the stop over is not the best of all the places on the BA network.
BA's ISB route is not struggling in my opinion...I've travelled during the winter time quite a few times on BA129/128 and the flight is full. They do NOT use 2 config a/c, they use 3 config. World Traveller, Traveller Plus, and Club World. BA does NOT have any 2 config 777s, they used to but they are ALL 3 config. now. The only route that was used for 2 config was Orlando and Tampa. G-YMMA thru G-YMMF are the a/c that BA uses for Islamabad...and the crew for these flights stays the night in Islamabad at the Serena Hotel which is a 5 star Hotel.

So personally, I would have to disagree with u there.
User avatar
cpt_747
Registered Member
Posts: 712
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 1:40 am
Location: London Heathrow

Post by cpt_747 »

speedbird london writes:
Well, yes that would be s possibilty to allow BMed to fly to Pak, but the fleet they use is far to small, the largest A/C being a A321.
I believe they have got few A330s beside A320s & A321s. So A321s are not the largest aircraft in their fleet.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/937012/M/
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/852915/M/
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/827996/M/
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/807745/M/
They are using A330-200s on their route to India, Canada, USA, and Saudi Arabia (Riyadh). So I think there is a possibility of BMI operating on LHR-Pakistan route.
The orbital speed of the Earth around the Sun averages about 30 km/s or 18 mps (108,000 km/h or 67000 mph).
Which means we're travelling 97 times the speed of sound. And yet we can't feel the motion,
SubhanAllah
speedbird london
Registered Member
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:39 pm

Post by speedbird london »

Firstly, you may classify the 777 as 3 class, though the World Traveller, traveller Plus are in affect Economy class. So in hence being called 2 class. Yes i agree the A/c you mention are used on the ISB route, and am sure the crew stay in 5* hotel. , but when the KHI flights were near end, the incoming crew took the A/C back to DXB. No one mentioned this applied for ISL.

As for the largest A/C for BMed, it is A321, and NOT A330, despite the incorrect photo links. I think members are getting mixed up with BMed and BMi, these are 2 different airlines, though UK based. BMed is assc. with BA, where as BMi is seperate airline.
stylo4444
Registered Member
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2004 4:01 pm
Location: Orlando, FL

Post by stylo4444 »

Junaid wrote:stylo4444,

I am flying ORD-ISB on BA next week. I am flying BA for the first time. How is the service and overall flight experience? Also, their cabin baggage allowance is only 13lbs. DO they really check the weight for cabin baggage?

Thanks
service is good...have only had one below average experience, and that was when catering really goofed up and we were not served lunch on BA128 back to London.

crew apologized but geez...no food on an 8 hour 15 min flight? that can't be good.