PIA wetleases

F.K · Post by **F.K** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 2:37 pm

ever since the airbuses have been sold this airline has been in a tailspin.leasing out dated tristars as hajj operators over the versatile b4s just shows lack of competence and the openess with which people have plundered pia.tristars have been banned by the saudi authorities since they are owned by an unheard of chater company and our ex-airbuses are flying in and out of manchester but i guess they just werent safe enough for our flyers.

F27 · Post by **F27** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 8:42 am

You are incorrect F.K. It is the dry lease of 6 P&W A310s and the newly leased B-777s that has sent the PIA into a financial tailspin, SATS and SWISSPORT notwithstanding.

Abbas Ali · Post by **Abbas Ali** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:01 am

F.K wrote:ever since the airbuses have been sold this airline has been in a tailspin.leasing out dated tristars as hajj operators over the versatile b4s just shows lack of competence and the openess with which people have plundered pia.tristars have been banned by the saudi authorities since they are owned by an unheard of chater company and our ex-airbuses are flying in and out of manchester but i guess they just werent safe enough for our flyers.

In TriStars case I agree with you. PIA should have acquired newer aircraft instead of old TriStars for Hajj operations.

In A300s case, as far as I know, five out six PIA A300s sold to MNG were scrapped/broken up at Karachi Airport recently because the Turkish aviation authorities did not issue certificate of air-worthiness to these aircraft. The surviving A300 (registration TC-MCA, ex-AP-BEL) remains parked at Karachi Airport.

Abbas

F27 · Post by **F27** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:05 pm

A pakistan parliament committee had issued a report in early 2006 where they had compared the selling price of 6 A300s. According to this report
i) TK signed the sale deed in June 2004.
ii) 'As is where is' fetched price was US$ 10.2m.
iii) 'As is where is' fleet had 2 CF6-50C2 power plants per aircraft.
iv) Each power plant with the acceptable EGT margin had a market price
of US $ 1.4m to US $ 1.8m.
v) Therefore 12 power plants had a total price tag of US $ 18.0m.
All the 6 A300 were fully loaded hence MNG and FlyAir did not need the planes for further operations.They refurbished their existing fleet. Courtesy saeed Akhter, Director Engineering.
Don't forget good old Rashid Hassan and Umer Ghafoor.

F.K · Post by **F.K** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:24 pm

atleast 4 of our aibuses (dont remember th registrations) are in active service with MNG, one is with iraq air which flies to manchester. the paki government throws out these sham reports to cover their asses. F27 you know just about nothing visavis this deal. it was ahmed saeed who initiated and sealed the whole exchange. today if we had retained even 4 b4s the situation would ve been under control with colosal savings.

Amaad Lone · Post by **Amaad Lone** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:27 pm

'As is where is' fetched price was US$ 10.2m.
iii) 'As is where is' fleet had 2 CF6-50C2 power plants per aircraft.
iv) Each power plant with the acceptable EGT margin had a market price
of US $ 1.4m to US $ 1.8m.
v) Therefore 12 power plants had a total price tag of US $ 18.0m.

This seems odd.

In 2001, PIA lost AP-BCJ to an accident in Dubai. PIA got $5 million for the 18 year old A300 as an insurance claim.

Are we suppose to belive that two engines of a 24-25 year old A300 are worth between $2.8 million to $3.6 million

Sounds like numbers are being thrown on this forum without really thinking.

GE-50C2s are used on DC-10-30s, and A300-B4s. Engines worth something to only people who are already operating fleets of such aircraft, or in this case MNG.

But still putting a price tag of $18 million on 12 engines seems far fetched.

But then again children of some PIA cockpit crew have always come up with far fetched stories.

FULLTHRUST · Post by **FULLTHRUST** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:16 am

Are we suppose to belive that two engines of a 24-25 year old A300 are worth between $2.8 million to $3.6 million

Amaad, thats true, the said engine is also used on 747s as well. In a situation where these engines need to be overhauled, an estimated cost of 0.8 mil to 1.5 mil must be kept in mind. They worth like that.

FULLTHRUST · Post by **FULLTHRUST** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:18 am

They refurbished their existing fleet. Courtesy saeed Akhter, Director Engineering.

F27 could you please elaborate on Saeed Akhter's........

FMC · Post by **FMC** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 7:12 pm

In 2001, PIA lost AP-BCJ to an accident in Dubai. PIA got $5 million for the 18 year old A300 as an insurance claim.
Now that is interesting. We had forgotten about the landing gear collapse of AP-BCJ. A couple of months back there was a rumour that the nose wheel of a PIA B-737 collapsed while it was being towed out of the hanger. Incidentally PIA has the facility of overhauling the B-737 landing gear at base. The affected gear had paid a shop visit just preceding the incident.
Also there was a newsreport about an accident while a B-737 tyre was being charged without the use of a pressure gauge.
AM can enlighten us on this issue. Thanx in advance AM.

F27 · Post by **F27** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 6:10 am

FULLTHRUST wrote:
They refurbished their existing fleet. Courtesy saeed Akhter, Director Engineering.
F27 could you please elaborate on Saeed Akhter's........

Mukhtar Kazi was the chief architect and Saeed Akhter followed suit. The A300s doled out to the Turks on 'ass is where is basis' were refurbished with the brand new or overhauled components from the PIA inventory. All this activity was supervised by Saeed Akhter who was seeking an extension to his super annuation. He did not get it. Everybody can't be Umer Ghafoor or Imran Maqsood.

AM · Post by AM » Sat Dec 23, 2006 7:03 pm

Thanx FMC for keeping me in thoughts.I have already posted some Info i could come across regarding the accident of tyre burst which resulted in a trajic loss of life a few months back.The CAA as well as PIA internal inquiry is out and both point out to some actions one of them was the shortcuts taken as a way of norm.As for the landing gear issue ,i better keep quiet. but we can sure have a discussion on that
Fullthrust ,both MQ and SA did all they could to keep thier seats .The MQ was a very weak person at that seat .As for SA I have learnt he had capabilities in his own way along with his limitations and at least he was more loyal to the company than the imported Kamra people.Do you know all the while AP-BGL was held up at MOSCOW AVM could not be contacted as he was on a vacation adding the long weekend with 3 days more in ISB to make it a whole week off in his home ,care to hoots what happens back in PIA.He was not there during recent EASA audit as well.

CoyBoy · Post by **CoyBoy** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 5:50 pm

That blue tailed aircraft with the Air Tahiti like design is infact an L1011, saw it yesterday.

zerbaer · Post by **zerbaer** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 3:08 am

In 2001, PIA lost AP-BCJ to an accident in Dubai. PIA got $5 million for the 18 year old A300 as an insurance claim.

Are we suppose to belive that two engines of a 24-25 year old A300 are worth between $2.8 million to $3.6 million

The aircraft was grossly under insured - Recall that during Ahmed Saeed's debauchery PK fleet was, for a while, entirely insured locally in order to 'save' money. One of the engines on that aircraft had been overhauled very recently before the incident by GE at near $3 million. Also recall that most of the emergency chutes did not deploy.

PK still remains a CF6-50 (E2) operator - ref: BAK & BAT. Depending of the mod status & time remaining, the engine values given are not at all far fetched.

Amaad Lone · Post by **Amaad Lone** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 8:41 am

If the aircraft was worth more then it was insured, then why was aircraft not repaired.

What would have been the repair cost of the A300??

FMC · Post by **FMC** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 11:12 am

AM wrote:Thanx FMC for keeping me in thoughts.I have already posted some Info i could come across regarding the accident of tyre burst which resulted in a trajic loss of life a few months back.The CAA as well as PIA internal inquiry is out and both point out to some actions one of them was the shortcuts taken as a way of norm.As for the landing gear issue ,i better keep quiet. but we can sure have a discussion on that
Fullthrust ,both MQ and SA did all they could to keep thier seats .The MQ was a very weak person at that seat .As for SA I have learnt he had capabilities in his own way along with his limitations and at least he was more loyal to the company than the imported Kamra people.Do you know all the while AP-BGL was held up at MOSCOW AVM could not be contacted as he was on a vacation adding the long weekend with 3 days more in ISB to make it a whole week off in his home ,care to hoots what happens back in PIA.He was not there during recent EASA audit as well.

AM , you are always on target. You have said it all. With due appologies AVM not only cares two hoots but also believes strongly in LPT.